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18

Current state of the game

Hi everyone,

First of all I’d like to apologise as we haven’t been holding you up to date on what is currently going on with the game for quite a while.

Our main focus has been on finding an investor and working on billed projects to gather resources and time for another possible full-time push. I also took a 2 week vacation including a caffeine fast after a long time to give myself some rest.

We definitely aren’t giving up on the game, but as it is right now we are taking it slower and gathering our strength and ideas. We are hoping to put enough resources aside so we could focus on the game full time once again rather than focus on several things at once as it’s less productive and eventually causes lower productivity in our billed projects as well as for the game. Meanwhile this is going on we are also thinking about the exact direction we should take.

If we do get time to work more on the game, it would be helpful if there was a post formulated with the biggest issues in the game right now. What do you think are the most influential things we could do with the game right now?

I understand current version of the simulator is lacking and it would either require tweaking current simulator or maybe it would be easier to go over to an event based game simulator version. What else comes to mind?

The issue with current simulator is that it tries too hard to simulate the real world. This for me means that I can’t possibly know everything that will work strategically when developing as it’s too chaotic.

Less chaotic way would be to not have players move around on a minimap, but have everything more event based. This would mean that the mini-map representation of the game would be a lot less fluid, but better text-commentary, better reflection of the strategy you are using and I think the events can have a lot of various interesting possibilities as well.

In general I hope you can still find the game enjoyable and for us it’s very motivating to see people playing.

Thank you for understanding.
-3
Hello )
Henry, you're cool.
IMHO the game is very weak visual component. In this component, the cs-manager wins very much. The faces of the players become native. For significant victories (1st league place, tournaments, championships, etc.) in the presentation of the team given a cup. This is an uncomplicated 30x30 png image, but they are also very pleasant. And here too dark and sad interface :( Faceless.
Finish the game mechanics that are not (splitpush, etc.), remove the interface's faseless and order advertising to top streamers on Twitch, who streaming moba-games. Profit.
:)
-1
What I want to see is that the game is much more dynamic. Like your midlaner has a huge lead on the enemy midlaner, so your jungler ganks mid more often and after they kill the opponent they will roam to another lane together or push the turret.
Also make pick ban more dynamic and let champions counter each other, this will make every champion viable because everyone has a counter, this should make pick ban much more skill based and here should the dynamic aspect come in. They pick pirate king top, then you could set it that if enemy picks blade dancer mid you pick professor brains mid for instance, since blade dancer is melee and prof is ranged and has better harras he should win laning phase normally.
Also atm players don't take damage from dragon / baron, alot of times I see that jungler just solo's baron when it spawns and this is just unrealistic. As of right now it's kind of risk free to do a huge objective like dragon or baron except if the enemy has set the same timer on it as you did, otherwise it's a free objective which has no disadvantages health wise. You also need to make vision and utility worth it, cause now it's pretty useless.
Furthermore make players smarter, alot of times I see them teamfight even when they are all on 10%hp, just make it so they will backoff if they can't finish a certain objective within the death timer of the enemy.
Last thing once again, is kill. Since minion aggro is still not a thing, the kill status most of the time has an advantage. If minion aggro is a thing and utility is better kill lanes would be harder because: A you take alot more damage(give minions like 15 damage lvl 1 and make it +5 for every new lvl) , B with better utility you can heal more(who doesn't know the fun time you have playing vs a soraka lane).
Edit: revamp the youth academy aswell, do it like i stated in a previous forum post:
"My idea for a better youth player system. Give them current and potential ability. For example, you invest 5million on a trial day and a few players come to that day. There you see their stats and then you can hire them, to make it fair don't show the precise CA and PA but an estimate. The more you spend the more chance you have at better players but even with low spending you could get lucky"
11
Maybe it'd be wise to have one location where all issues and idea's are gathered so everyone can see them and comment on them, get inspired from them and give their own 2 cents about them. How about one of the mods sift through every comment here and adds every major issues and every interesting and thoughtful ideas to the main post.

That being said, I'd like to see:

Gameplay

- More diversity in strategies and builds
-> Explanation: Right now only a couple different strategies and builds seem to dominate the scene. We need more options which are as equally strong as the other to create more diversity.
-> Possible solution 1: Besides kill, farm, .. add a strategy called Protect. A player with this strat would focus on defending another player by using CC, healing, tanking, ...
-> Possible solution 2: Rework armor and magic resist. There is no way to know in advance if your player should build armor or mr so it's not usefull at all. Either make it dynamic somehow or make both stronger.

- Every champion stat being as usefull as the other
-> Explanation: This is not based on known facts but it seems that scaling, aoe, and splitpush are unused stats and do nothing in a game. Other stats like utility and range don't seem quite so impactfull either.
-> Solution: This would need development in the game simulator but it'd be worth it to have better balance in the usefullness of those stats. It would mean more diversity overall.

- Smarter buffs & nerfs
-> Explanation: At the moment buffs and nerfs apply the same % on every stat. You should buff weak stats and nerf stats that are just too strong.
-> Example: Gem Knight's laning stat is 0 while his support stat is 102. His laning is super awefull while his support is incredibly good. But because of the laning stat he remains the worst champion ever.

- Peak stats for retired players
-> Explanation: It saddens me to see my retired players with such low stats in the history tab while they were way better during their peaks.
-> Solution: Instead of showing the ending stats of a retired player, capture the peaks of each stat and show these in the history tab? Open for debate.

- Academy clarity
-> Explanation: I had been avoiding the academy a very long time because I didn't know what it exactly did or what it was usefull for even with the couple descriptions here and there.
-> Possible solutions: Add more info, make it clearer, design a better layout, show progress,...

- Seperate upcoming League Games from Ranked Games
-> Explanation: At certain moments you can see your upcoming league games because no other ranked games are planned but as soon as ranked games are planned you can no longer see your upcoming league games because ranked games take up all 5 slots.
-> Solution: Seperate them in another tab. It just avoids confusion plus you don't have to go to the league schedule every time.

- More subscriber features
-> Explanation: Right now the only thing that might convince me to subscibe is only to change the names of my players. Give us more extra features or benefits and we might subscibe more. Take note that this would directly mean more pay for you so considder this as one of the most important items on this list.
-> Examples: Give us a free tournament to organize every time we subscribe for 7 days? Badges with increasing fancyness for being subscribed for X days in total? More profile customisation while being subbed? (Different colors, borders, champion themes,...)


Community

- Club Tournaments (PLEAAAASSEEEE)
-> Explanation: C'mon guys it would be so great to be able to fight with your club against other clubs. So far this game is pure single-player, it's you vs someone else. Add "your club vs another club" and it would bring a whole new dimension to this manager game. This would also be THE way to determine which of two clubs is the better one. It'd bring life to the whole clubs scene. It'd mean more talking inside clubs because everyone would be discussing strategies to defeat certain players on the other club etc and it'd also mean more talking between the clubs themselves to discuss and talk about the ongoing of the tournament. We'd have more reason to talk about stuff which is great to the community overall. I'd have so much fun competing with other clubs and discussing strategies with my club. Make the results of these tournaments public as well so everyone can see which club won and which club lost. I believe people would start creating clubs just so they can compete with them. More clubs mean more community activty, more players staying, overall super healthy for the game.
-> How it could work: I think there are many ways these club scrim-offs could work. One of them being a system where every player of each club plays every player on the opponent club. Could work in rounds just like the league system. The club with the most wins, wins the club tournament. Another way could be a system where the #1 players of each club play against each other, #2 players vs each other, #3 vs #3,... Idk just thinking out load.

- Sorting of club members
-> Explanation: just something small but it'd be nice to have members sorted by elo to better see how you stand in your club.


Extra

- Open source projects?
-> Explanation: There might be other developers among us, just like me, that would like to help out this game in any way possible. Right now there is nothing we can do to assist you guys.
-> Example: Set up a git hub or something with a demo version of your website with dummy ajax calls. Let us develop in there and as soon as you think someone developed something that would be usefull, review it with your team and implement it in the real website? I'd be willing to give it a shot to help out with the responsiveness of the website. Got quite some experience in that matter :)
-2
Just put old GE again, right now all starts are 30health\70damage, kill or hur and stay very behind. Nothing more work.
Before we could work with utility, armour...

And game without any updates is making a lot of managers leave and the ones that come don't stay
-3
What if we actually had items which we can tell our laners to buy instead of having these scales?
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From someone who's kind of new (few weeks) but really enjoying the game, and coming at least twice a day:

-I'm still annoyed that Academy can't train multiple roles at the same time. I want an academy team, not a jungle academy.
-The "meta" is hard to read, and hard to see how it's really efficient. Also, stats are kind of a mess, and useless for the most part. I want actually thought strategy, not a bundle of health and damage.
-It's extremely hard for "lower" teams to get their hand on good players since way too many teams can just get full cash out. There's no way I can compete with someone who can easily blow 5-6M cash on a player when I barely have 1M in my account. And scouting seems extremely unreliable and weak. I've spent more than 1M in scouting, and still get players under 1600 ELO... add more scouted players ? I have a seriously hard time getting my hands on good players despite trying hard and investing a lot into it. And the only good ones I can get are old.

Other than that, I 110% agree with [ND] Creative. Including subscribing (which I didn't, but thought about and seen as "not worth") and open-source (also experienced dev here)
-1
with help from the comunity a new player can understand the game. without a plyer can't.
the tutorial has a lot of text and his pathing is in loop. has new player my first two days were confusing and Club Soda contacted me and helped me out.
for now you should delete the tutorial and make a new one that is actual step by step. also after creating have a team to test it. un untested feature is not good for the game.

for the game you need to work on the strategy planning. vision has no use for now. the best use for vision is to prevent baron from be taken without being contested (team fight) and to help split pushing without getting colapsed on.
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@Lodok This part pretty much destroys the market if that were to be the case though. You'd just constantly cycle through academy teams.
"-I'm still annoyed that Academy can't train multiple roles at the same time. I want an academy team, not a jungle academy."
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You're right about the Market, and I thought about it.

But my point still stands, in the matter that only very high team can afford these academy players anyway. I feel like the market should be more for lower teams, while higher roll out on Academy (which is basically reality, let's be fair)

As I told just a bit higher, market is super hard to use for low-mid tier teams anyway. Don't have the money to buy any Academy-Trained players. And I don't want the failed bad players that are rotting in the market either.

By improving scouting, you can keep the Market relevant quite easily.

Or you could also make 2-3 roles off the Academy instead of just one, but not extend to 5.
0
@Lodok "Or you could also make 2-3 roles off the Academy instead of just one, but not extend to 5."
I think this would be cool , lets say if you can train 2 roles instead of only 1 but in this case the money spent should scale imo something like 150k or even 200k per player instead of 100k ( if you choose to train 2 diff roles )
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Since there was critique towerds the tutorial that it is not helpful enough. I can't agree on this one. I started this game knowing nothing about it. Just read the tutorial and didn't engage with other players and still got my team on a really good start with ending up in the top 5 of new teams. So if you read carefully, experiement a bit (which what I think is one of the most important aspects of this game) and have a bit of knowledge about mobas the tutorial is just fine. Also I don't think it's necessary bad to have to engage with other players or read the forum to get good at the game.
The tutorial tells you how to play it -> Other players give you tips on how to play it better
I think it's good this way
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@Lodok I know a way to train an entire team without needing the market and you can make money too. However you need to have atleast $5m initial investment and gaming house lv10.
0
I think the academy needs some reworking.

Right now, I hear the only way to really be competitive is to buy 5 fresh 13 year olds from the academy, and coach them to high skill.
Players trained in the academy have an issue where they cost too much for their skill. All the high tier players i see dont want them because they aren't good enough, and the low tier players dont want them because they cost too much.

I read somewhere once the idea of being able to employ retired players at your academy. choose x of your players (maybe this is an up gradable number for another money sink) and based on their stats it influences the rate your secondaries train. could make it so that they get a randomized "financial skill" for when they are employed to cut costs for training.

I think this would be a great idea since people could get better players for less investment, (either by increasing their gains or decreasing their costs) and free up some market overhead. Plus if you made it so retired players can work in the academy until they are say 60, it gives us a whole other section of the game to manage.
3
Hey guys, I finally found the time to write it down – wall of text incoming:

Let´s split the thing into 3 parts:
1) Micro-game, which covers strategy and the GE
2) Macro-game, which covers team building, finances, facilities, market etc.
3) Community, which covers communication, tutorial, TAP etc.
I see the game as a building, where the community is the basement, the micro- and macro-games are pillars and the roof is “FUN”.

1) Micro-game
I think the issue here has already been revealed many times. There are too few viable strategies and the meta is very stable. Most of you call for a new GE that fixes this problem, but in the current stance I don´t think that it is really possible to do so (Devs can´t afford to work full time + I think you guys underestimate, how hard it is to make a balanced GE – there will most likely be always one strat that is superior).

That´s why I will propose a new approach: Patches
I don´t know about you guys, but for me the time of hotfixes was one of the best MM times. I mainly play MM because of the micro game/strat testing. I don´t really care if I have to do strat work because we have a super nice GE and I have to adapt to my opponents new strats, or if I have to adapt to small changes to the GE. I don´t rly know how much work this hotfixes were. But I think doing small GE changes after every half split would be really nice (e.g. buff utility, buff amor, nerf laning, nerf teamfights)

2) Macro-game

Let´s break it down to some big points – I will try to give small solutions which focus the specific problems. I will also do a second post which is an approach about how to rebuild the whole macro-game.

-) Rebuilding – people who want to compete at the top need a full rebuild and have to wait multiple seasons for it. In this time the chances are very high that they lose interest and quit the game.

Solution: less time needed for a rebuild; possibility to build the next line up without letting your current one drop completely

-) Market – in the current state the market is mainly for the new players to buy some cheap and good players. Even if there are perfectly trained, young players we can´t rly buy them because the age mostly doesn´t fit our team and we would rebuild before he spikes. Furthermore we can´t train the new guy without letting our current player fade, so we lose out on strength again.

Solution: There is no simple solution to this. It would require a big update of the whole macro-game (see 2nd post)

-) Finances – in the current state money doesn´t do much. I managed my finances well and hit 100M today. And what can I do with this now? There is nothing worth to buy....this feels like all the managing was unnecessary.

Solution: Give us new possibilities to spend our money.

-) Academy – The academy should be the best place to train your youth, you can only train 1 position so you would guess that at least this 1 guy (or multiple with the same role) would be super strong. But no…because of the weak side strats indoor coaching with coaches is superior.

Solution: buff side strats for the academy so it can compete with indoor coaching. (This could also help the market – training multiple players for the 1 role and then trading on market)

3) Community
Not much to say here, I think the ingame chat and the club structure are still the main problems.
3
Macro-game rebuild

This is my new approach to rebuild the macro-game and fix most of its current problems.

Academy-scout
I think the Academy should have their own youth-scout, you don´t just start with a 13yo guy with 3 stat everywhere. But you can scout for up to 500k per day (100k per player) and find young guys with random stats. 100k gives you someone between 13 and 14yo, 30k between 14 and 15yo and so on. And the guys have all over the board random values between 2 and 10. This is a money sink + helps the market.

Academy-training
You should be able to buy players from the market and put them into your academy. The academy should give the possibility to get a full new roster. You can train as many players as you want, but it costs like 50k per day per player. Furthermore you can determine which skill they train, per player you have like 70p and you can distribute them yourself (maximum 10 per skill). This training has to be better than indoor training with like 16sessions to prevent the full indoor rebuild.

Line-up swap
After they reached some sort of cap like 40stats in 1skill, an overall cap or a certain age like 18, the training should slow down and get lower than normal coaching training. This prevents ppl from keeping them too long (this could lead to the problem, that they wait until the team is 23 with a super op team that stomps everyone + their other line up will be gone by then and it has the same disadvantages like a full indoor rebuild).

So what are the advantages of this approach?
1) A random factor that should have some but not too much influence. This makes the game more interesting and helps the market
2) Training a full roster in your academy so a full indoor rebuild is not needed
3) Setting the trainingskills so the team fits your personal wishes (giving it some kind of personal touch)
4) Money sink. We would have something to do with our money (hunting the perfect player)